Analysing Chinese’ Faulty Logic and False Reasoning Around Public Urination and Defaecation

Passion Times

23rd April, 2014

Analysing Chinese’ Faulty Logic and False Reasoning Around Public Urination and Defaecation




Besides Chinese like Betty Wong, who despite benefitting from the handouts offered by the HKSAR Government and the systems in Hong Kong, turn around and accuse Hong Kong and Hongkongers of “mistreating” them, there are also Chinese “monster parents” who would voluntarily pull down their children’s trousers and encourage them to urinate or defaecate in public. When people photograph their crime (urinating and defacecating in public is against the law in Hong Kong), they point their fingers at the ones photographing them and shout “you are taking photos of other’s private parts!” This is no different from a rapist saying that “that woman’s clothes are too sexy and provocative”, in order to legitimise his crime.

Sometimes a call of nature does come out of the blue. It is understandable for parents to immediately try to find a place for relief, especially for children who have less self-control. However, this is not a good excuse. Responsible parents should beware of their children’s biological needs, and check with them every now and then if they need to visit the facilities, as parents would check if their children are hungry, in order to avoid any urgency or accident. Tourists from across the world have proven that they can do so, or else we would have seen children of different nationalities answering their call of nature everywhere. One cannot help but ask why only Chinese seem to find this impossible to do. If a child is too young, he or she should be wearing nappy. When a child is beyond the age to wear nappy, parents should teach him or her to use the bathroom and to tell the parents whenever they feel the need to go. Failing to know this makes one unfit to be a parent. Parents of other nationalities do not pull their children’s trousers down to relieve themselves in public! When I come to think of it, it all comes down to Chinese being inconsiderate. Numerous times we have seen headlines or photos circulated online with captions like, “Chinese tourist holding child to urinate in Disneyland’s bathroom sink”, “Chinese child wee in public”, “Chinese defaecate in the middle of the street”, “Chinese helps child to urinate in a glass in restaurant” and so on. These happen in Hong Kong far too often after the sovereignty handover in 1997. When you tell them off, they turn around and say that you should have allowed them because it is human right. It is a must for them to defend their right to answer the call of nature everywhere!

Chinese adults doing their business in public are no news in Hong Kong either. The strangest thing is we do not see Hongkongers, tourists from other countries, developed countries or not, and foreign workers in Hong Kong to answer calls of nature in public! There are occasions that people have to answer these calls immediately at the corner of a back ally or in the bushes. Biological needs are the same regardless of skin colour and nationality. But, why only Chinese have to answer their calls in broad daylight in the middle of the street or shopping mall, so very often?

Many of us have probably experienced an upset stomach when traveling, perhaps because it hasn’t adjusted to the local food and water. I dare to say it is a fair observation that the only people who would relieve themselves of this discomfort in the middle of the street as if the rest of the world does not exist are Chinese. One may argue that people from other countries have done the same, but the frequency is miles lower compare to that of Chinese. Let us be more tolerant, even if you have to do it immediately, you would choose a back ally or a corner away from all the people, wouldn’t you? Do Chinese really do the same in their own land? Even in the countryside or rural areas where trees and bushes are everywhere, people would still pick somewhere that is away from all the people instead of doing their businesses in the middle of the street?! Sometimes I wonder could the extremely high frequency of Chinese urinating or defaecating in public caused by the especially loose anal sphincter or small bladder?

In the animal kingdom, it is animal instinct to excrete to mark their territories. I do not know if this could explain the Chinese’s almost hysterically frequent excretion in the public in Hong Kong. In fact, nothing can really explain their behaviour. Yet, Chinese seem to have the ability to legitimise their behaviour and their typical response is “you have done wrong, so my wrong is not wrong anymore” (two wrongs don’t make a right doesn’t seem to be a popular Chinese proverb). However, the fact is that they commit wrongdoing first (defaecating or urinating in public) which provoke others to respond (taking photo or tell them off). In spite of this fact, they seem to believe that such wrongdoings are reasonable. When they fail to prevail in reasoned argument (in fact, they are usually shrill in defence of their wrongdoing), they pretend to be picked upon and accuse their accusers of bullying them. Many people who do not know the facts or simply cannot tell black from white might fall for this trick: not only Chinese would fall for these lame “reasons”, many naïve westerners who are ignorant about the facts would accuse Hongkongers who publish photo evidence as perverts. Even if the faces or private parts are blurred out, these naïve people fall for the Chinese’s diversion tactic and shift their focus from “someone exposed his/her private parts (or his/her child’s private parts) in public” to “someone who took picture evidence of a crime is a pervert bullying the Chinese”. Even if the number of Chinese were small, tolerance will not resolve the problem or conflict. The situation is far worse because the number of Chinese tourists in Hong Kong is higher than the entire population of Hong Kong by several orders of magnitude! Do Chinese see Hong Kong as a gigantic public toilet? This is not “defending human rights”, this is Chinese exploiting Hong Kong, yet accusing Hongkongers who defend their homeland against this disgusting exploitation of “discriminating against them”. This, my friend, is a typical Chinese trait.

Would you tolerate Chinese going to your country and urinating and defaecating everywhere in public? If you would not accept thousands of Chinese tour groups that amount to more than your country’s population relieving themselves in your back yard, then stop accusing Hongkongers of discriminating against Chinese! You accomplices, who defend these Chinese behaviours, please imagine you have to tolerate a bunch of Chinese tourists visiting your home who always complain that your bathroom is too far away and instead choose to answer their calls of nature in your living room or on your sofa. Please tolerate them! We are all citizen of the earth!

By Lady Kylie

Editor’s Note:

The article went viral since it was published, and the Facebook account of the author was suspended as a result. It is believed that the 50-cents party members have reported the photo associated with this article to Facebook.

Related articles:

To Tolerate Further, Hongkongers Will be Reduced to Animals



17 responses to “Analysing Chinese’ Faulty Logic and False Reasoning Around Public Urination and Defaecation

  1. I already seen some foreign posts about this situation and the strangest thing is they all say ‘that’s just a baby, Hongkongers behavior was awful!’. Then I respond – would you like their baby shit in your city? Or maybe let them do it in your backyard if you think that’s acceptable behavior.
    I don’t blame a baby, it doesn’t know it’s bad but the parents should be aware of it. They later had mouth to argue, where was it when they could ask about a direction? I was in HK 2 years ago last time, I spoke no Cantonese and I still managed to find a restroom without my husband’s help. Now there are even more shopping malls with free toilet, I can bet you can have a diarrhea in public place and still make it on time to the toilet! Not to mention all people focus only on this case but they forget it’s not only this situation, it’s not always the baby. Every few days I see pics of pee and shit in Hong Kong – on the street, in the shop!, subway car.
    If anyone says that it was Hongkongers who behaved bad then they should let all those people do their stuff in their home and see how happy they would be about it.

    • Well said MHKH.
      The foreign presses are being controlled by China and a lot of Chinese spy are working in there, therefore they would speak for Chinese even they are doing it wrong. Even Killing the Tibetan and erase their culture is fine in Chinese’s eyes. Those people seeing it from nice apartment area would never understand invaders coming to sh8t in front of your house kind of thing and will tell you just accept it. I wish the worse karma goes to them.

    • The toddler in the incident is at least 3 years old. Overwhelming majority of kids in Hong Kong at this age are toilet trained, and parents often remember to check if the kid need to go from time to time. If the parents know their child has an issue of controlling their bladder / bowl, they would have the kid wear a “pull-up” nappy as a aid to transit to totally be off the diaper.

  2. Pingback: Analysing Chinese’ Faulty Logic and False Reasoning Around Public Urination and Defaecation | Real Hongkonger in Hong Kong·

  3. I’ve seen foreigners saying this too.
    It’s all about the mainlanders and how they react to a difficult situation or confrontation. They did something wrong first, baby poops in the street. But, as their history as been wiped clean of any wrong doing, from Chairman Mao to Tiananmen, the government and the people have wiped their slates clean, time and time again. This gives the people a sense that they and their country haven’t and do not do anything wrong. So they get emotionally defensive and put blame on the accuser. They hold their ‘face’ high at all times and if someone comes along and tries to make them lose it, they will defend it to the point of trying to make you lose face (in this case, the parents give the child to the person taking the video. What kind of parent would do that? not even thinking about the child when they say “take it!” talk about traumatising your child!).
    You can see, in every circumstance, every video clip, from on the streets to inside the MTR, I’ve yet to see a Mainlander stop, be humble, and say sorry. In their eyes, due to brainwashing and a communist perspective on history, they will always be right.
    It’s fucking stupid.

    I’m British living in Xiamen (moving to HK later this year)

    • Thank you for your comment, very well written. Agree with you that many foreigners seem to be misguided in that sense. Have you read that Wall Street Journal article? It cited only China publications for source, the first hand photos and videos are taken by local Hongkongers (one of them is a photojournalist), yet Wall Street Journal did not include any of them! When we dug into who those reporters are, we realised that it was no coincidence…
      Share our work, let the world know that it’s not what they are told to believe/think. The only thing that matters in this is quite simply: someone broke the law in Hong Kong (defaecating in public). Since when people have to exhaust all means to make up excuses (or fabricate them) to legitimise someone’s wrongdoing? Will we start making excuses up for Chinese (or any other race) for even more serious crime?
      Glad to hear that you’re moving to Hong Kong. Looking forward to welcoming you!

    • That is China men for you! As there is a chinese phase of “10 years never change”

  4. the f***ing 50-cents chinese party is defending this incident by all means, they are saying that the boy in the incident is a girl, the “girl” is being photographed of her private part, and they think that the “girl” is just urinating but not having a #2, worse, they accuse hongkongers photoshoped the photo adding a poo to frame the Chinese parents, however, the hong kong police announced that the children in the incident is a boy, and you can see clearly in the photo what he is doing, right? the f***ing chinese party is trying to suppress hong kong people by all means, turning black to white and white to black, f*** china! f*** the communists!

    • Thank you for your comment.
      We share your frustration and many Hongkongers are furious about these twisted “logic” Chinese came up with.
      Sorry that we have to “censored” your message as it came across a bit aggressive. We encourage debate, but we want to prevent an unnecessary argument. We hope you’d understand.
      Please also note that we almost NEVER delete comments on this blog, except for spam and messages that basically say nothing but swear words.
      Please visit our blog again soon!

  5. there was a TED talk about this topic.”I’d grown up thinking that a toilet like that was my right, when in fact it’s a privilege. 2.5 billion people worldwide have no adequate toilet. They don’t have a bucket or a box. Forty percent of the world with no adequate toilet. And they have to do what this little boy is doing by the side of the Mumbai Airport expressway, which is called open defecation, or poo-pooing in the open. And he does that every day, and every day, probably, that guy in the picture walks on by, because he sees that little boy, but he doesn’t see him.” It might be controversial to point out, but if it were not for British technological innovation, Hong Kong could easily still be facing these sanitary problems as mainland China. The culture of using the toilet is still less than 200 years old, Hong Kong needs to educate, not shame the Mainland. No matter how the Mainland reacts to these photos, the important thing is to teach the culture of utilizing Toilets, or promote clean sanitary conditions even on the mainland. This is also a problem in Mumbai, or India… if you take the time to watch the TED talk, and not limited to Hong Kong.

    • Perhaps we should look at public urination and defaecation as one thing that is quite simple: uncivilised behaviour.

      There is no need to dig and spin historical facts or theories or anything else to justify such behaviour. What is wrong cannot be right by making excuses after excuses: despite the fact that flushing toilet was a “relatively new” invention, Chinese is the only group of people that does that in Hong Kong, our home, why should we look at beyond Hong Kong if we are reporting on Hong Kong news? Would you suggest that President Obama should go to China and educate Chinese about public hygiene? It should be local government that’s responsible for it. Right? That is exactly why Hongkongers are not obligated to help Chinese for achieving democracy. If the United Nation cannot do so, why would the entire world put that pressure on Hong Kong to be “the model for China to learn about democracy”?

      If they can afford to travel, they are most certainly not from the rural villages that have not heard of public hygiene. What amazes a lot of Hongkongers is that the entire world seem to gang up to defend Chinese for behaviours that are sub-standard (uncvilised isn’t strong enough a word sometimes). Fair enough if the world wishes to offer Chinese yet another chance, but please not at the cost of Hong Kong and Hongkongers! Perhaps, Westerners should open their arms and welcome all these Chinese to visit their countries and give them first hand education about what civilisation is, and not having to use Hongkongers as the middlemen who they condemn as xenophobic or racists when we want to wash our hands off matters related to Chinese – simply because we are sick and tired of it!

      Hongkongers have tolerated this for quite some time, and many have tried to reason with Chinese. Yet all they got was scold at and accused of being racist or discriminate against Chinese.
      There are posts in this blog and many other platforms you could read about all these, so I would not bored you with them here.

      Why is it only Chinese that does that in Hong Kong so very often? Almost every other day! For the sake of quoting your argument, there are plenty of Indian in Hong Kong, I have yet to see any of them committing the same crime Chinese commit so very often…

      Another question, Chinese seems to have privilege in Hong Kong – there were cases of people of different ethnicity being prosecuted for urinating in public, but with all the evidence Hongkongers gathered, Chinese seem to be immune to the legal system in Hong Kong – this brings a much bigger picture story that you need to study and read a lot more to understand or start to join the dots. A hint: China colonisation.

      I’m only one of the editors of TRHKN, so I cannot represent all the editors here. I am confident, however, that this is a fair observation.

  6. Pingback: Authorities Turn Blind Eyes to Smugglers, but CANNOT Tolerate Elderly Make a Living | North District Random - Hong Kong Random·

  7. The big question is, where the hell are the FEHD and the police? Are they now relegated to roughing up old grannies? CY Leung and his administration are an abomination. Now they are telling us to tolerate public defecation? Have they forgotten not so long ago when infected feces led to dozens of deaths from SARS in Amoy Gardens? Instead of solving the problem, CY and his ilk seem to want to create greater divisions in society!

  8. As a Hongkonger, I can say we have tolerated Chinese for years (like eating and drinking on MTR, talking loudly, being treated impolitely)because we understand that they get used to do so and might not know it is inappropriate.
    However, when someone told them what they were doing was inappropriate, they rarely reacted as a civilized person.
    Some of them were really nice and might apologize in this situation(but rarely). Sometimes they would ignore us and continued. Sometimes they would shout at and attack opponent (even in extremely impolite and dirty way)
    .And for these Chinese, they usually thinks that it is fine to break rules when they are “in need”, and you are mean if you don’t allow them to break the rule. They only think they have lost face when they are told that they have done wrong. In order to save face, they will try to make the opponent speechless to show they are “right” and “have won”.
    There are dozens of videos of arguing on Youtube, and hundreds of post about these problems on Hongkongers’ secret page. Hongkongers have been facing all these for more than TEN YEARS. Hongkongers have got enough.

  9. Pingback: Hong Kong | toemail·

  10. Seriously, it’s totally against the HK law! Did the parents and those adults get ticketed? It seems like no one reported the end result of those wrongdoings, why?

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